Where to start in scaling and progressing through levels…
Posted: 26 March 2009 02:27 PM   [ Ignore ]
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I have been back and forth doing crossfit at a local affiliate gym and more standard cardio/weights routines for the last few months. I am looking at moving to doing the official mainsite WOD’s on my own as my primary workout.

How do I figure out which level I should be starting at with the scaling of the workouts, and when should I be moving up to a new level??

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Posted: 26 March 2009 02:51 PM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 1 ]
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Well, as it says in the activation email you got when you signed up to the forum  angry  wink , start low. If you really have no idea where to start, then go with the lowest scaling on offer.
The WOD will come around again and you can always move up then.

When to move up a level?
When you’re doing the WOD about as fast as other top performers.

Good sources of info for times for WODs are the Brand X underdawg list http://www.crossfitbrandx.com/index.php/forums/viewthread/1100/ and the comments on the mainsite WODs http://www.crossfit.com/


There are no hard and fast rules on this aspect so if you’ve had a look at those places and you’re not sure, your best bet is to ask when you post your results on the WOD forum.

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Craig Massey


“The point of CF is to get better at life.  Being unable to workout tomorrow because you were pigheaded today is not in line with our goals.”
Garddawg - 22 March 2009

“CrossFit is not dangerous.
Bad coaching is dangerous, poor movement is dangerous. Ego is dangerous.
CrossFit, properly scaled to the individual is the safest and most efficient program available for strength, conditioning and movement.”
BlueBugofJustice - 18 August 2009

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Posted: 26 March 2009 03:03 PM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 2 ]
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First, what Metric said! 

Second, do what feels right to you.  Some days you might be a Big Dawg, others, a buttercup.

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Posted: 26 March 2009 03:14 PM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 3 ]
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Yes, and that.

Should have said. Pack, Buttercups etc isn’t a classification of your overall performance, it’s a WOD by WOD level.

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Craig Massey


“The point of CF is to get better at life.  Being unable to workout tomorrow because you were pigheaded today is not in line with our goals.”
Garddawg - 22 March 2009

“CrossFit is not dangerous.
Bad coaching is dangerous, poor movement is dangerous. Ego is dangerous.
CrossFit, properly scaled to the individual is the safest and most efficient program available for strength, conditioning and movement.”
BlueBugofJustice - 18 August 2009

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Posted: 26 March 2009 05:55 PM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 4 ]
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It’s not a science, hit it slow at first then go from there.

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Posted: 26 March 2009 07:40 PM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 5 ]
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And remember, and this is hard to get across to new folks, so I’ll repeat it:  It doesn’t matter if you eff up a wod.  We all do.  In fact, at some point, you may do it on purpose . . .  Take notes.  Was it too easy? Too hard?  Okay, you’ve got data.  Press on.  After about 6 months, you’ve seen probably 80% of the things that happen around here.  You’ll get a an eerie ability to predict outcomes: “Okay, I can do x box jumps in 15 minutes, hmmmm” and you’ll be able to predict scalings.  That’s why we advise starting in a lower scaling.  You may finish first.  Good for you! Move up!  wink

TP

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Posted: 01 February 2010 04:42 PM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 6 ]
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I think it would make a lot of sense if we could equate the WOD scaling with the “Basic Strength Standards” put out by the Aasgaard Company (I never heard of them??) which are categorized 5 ways from “un-trained” to “Elite”.  Right now, I weigh 165 pounds and I am basically hitting the “novice” numbers.  At the novice level, I see in the fine print that it typically takes an individual 3 to 9 months to acquire this level of fitness.  I started end of 09/09 and it is now 02/01/10 so I am right on track.

In any case, it would make life easy to say that a person capable of a certain level should do “X” for this particular WOD.  Also, I am confused that sometimes it says to use a particular weight- like today it specifies 155 pound thrusters.  This would be applicable for what body weight?  I would prefer to see if at all possible “do thrusters at 75% of body weight”.  Bigger people can lift more, of course.  Crossfit seems like such a science, why can’t we incorporate this stuff?

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Posted: 01 February 2010 04:48 PM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 7 ]
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1. Everyones skills and strengths are different in different categories. When you are talking about three lifts that is easy. For example on crossfit.com I believe there is a similar chart for the crossfit total (deadlift, shoulder press, squat). But in crossfit there are wayyyyyyyyyyyyy too many variables.

2. Nature doesnt care how much you weigh why should crossfit. If a 500 pound log is in your way you need to move it wether you are 100# or 300#. Also what about BW exercises should I do less push ups and not run as far because I weigh 240? No ofcourse not I get my gigantic ass on that bar and do 150 pull ups if that is what is asked of me.

Any questions?

mastroj

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Posted: 01 February 2010 04:58 PM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 8 ]
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civilsid - 01 February 2010 04:42 PM

I think it would make a lot of sense if we could equate the WOD scaling with the “Basic Strength Standards” put out by the Aasgaard Company (I never heard of them??) which are categorized 5 ways from “un-trained” to “Elite”.  Right now, I weigh 165 pounds and I am basically hitting the “novice” numbers.  At the novice level, I see in the fine print that it typically takes an individual 3 to 9 months to acquire this level of fitness.  I started end of 09/09 and it is now 02/01/10 so I am right on track.

In any case, it would make life easy to say that a person capable of a certain level should do “X” for this particular WOD.  Also, I am confused that sometimes it says to use a particular weight- like today it specifies 155 pound thrusters.  This would be applicable for what body weight?  I would prefer to see if at all possible “do thrusters at 75% of body weight”.  Bigger people can lift more, of course.  Crossfit seems like such a science, why can’t we incorporate this stuff?

The weight specified relates to your ability, not your bodyweight.
If you weigh 300 pounds and have never trained in your life you’re going to use the bar or PVC for that WOD, if you weigh 100 pounds and you can leap tall buildings in a single bound, you’ll use 155 and set a world record for the WOD.

In general, but not always, what weight you should use in a metcon is a function of the time it takes to complete the WOD. If you use 95pounds in Fran and take 20 minutes to complete it with lots of breaks for muscular exhaustion, you overloaded yourself. If you finish in 1 minute and are barely out of breath you scaled back too far. We discuss this a little in the FAQs/Beginners forum here http://www.crossfitbrandx.com/index.php/forums/viewthread/4910/

As for specifying who should use what level, that varies from WOD to WOD. Unless your surname is Salo, you’re bound to be better at some things than others, so saying that because you’re good at WOD x you should use Scaling B on WOD y doesn’t often work.

As TP says, with experience you can pick it, most of the time. grin

And I agree that it’s frustrating BTW. Once you get tuned into it it gets less so.

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Craig Massey


“The point of CF is to get better at life.  Being unable to workout tomorrow because you were pigheaded today is not in line with our goals.”
Garddawg - 22 March 2009

“CrossFit is not dangerous.
Bad coaching is dangerous, poor movement is dangerous. Ego is dangerous.
CrossFit, properly scaled to the individual is the safest and most efficient program available for strength, conditioning and movement.”
BlueBugofJustice - 18 August 2009

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Posted: 02 February 2010 08:39 AM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 9 ]
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Yes, I understand that level of fitness is definitely related to amount of weight a person should be using.  The WOD, as given, is the top level or at least I would assume so but not everybody has the same weight at that top level.  I’m done beating the hell out of that dead horse- next more important topic for me is that I also understand there is a range- too fast or too slow and a range in between.  I have done several of the “ladies” over the last couple months but I am sure I have not done all of them.  Is there a target time for beginners?  On many occasions when I was first starting, I did not bother to record my time- I simply struggled to finish.  The funny thing is that it was usually not muscle exhaustion from lifting to much weight, it was simply feeling like I was going to puke so I would stop until I thought I could eek out the rest of the exercise- but I definitely had a couple DNF’s in there.  Of course, if I used a lighter weight, I may never have felt pukey at all but the stopper for me was the sick stomach feeling- which I would get regardless of rowing, running, or lifting.  Sometimes I still get that- I try to eat well- trying to stay as close to Dr. Sears Zone as possible.

But…  once I get to where I can do the exercise without getting an upset stomach, where along the range or spectrum should I be targeting?  A faster time would be a more aerobic style workout and a slower time would be more of an anaerobic one.  And I know that yes, all the exercises are different so we should maybe not aim for the same time on each of them.

What is your opinion about doing the same workout with a higher frequency?  Maybe every Friday, go back to the same set of exercises so that over a month or so, it feels better and provides more self confidence.  I think I might do that.  Of course one of the best things about CF is that it never gets boring but then I can go 3 or 4 months and not see the same workout twice but I know I am getting stronger because my max lifts slowly increase.

I would also think that the folks that can RX don’t ask these sorts of questions- they have been doing this stuff for years and they know exactly what they can and can not accomplish on a given workout.

Oh well, I guess this stuff is all very subjective and maybe we each simply need to be aware of our bodies and how we react to certain levels of exertion and just do what feels comfortable (or mildly uncomfortable, as the case may be) to us.

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Posted: 02 February 2010 12:35 PM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 10 ]
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Well your brain is obviously going so thats a good thing. But some of the things you might be missing, or maybe you simply dont realize how important they are is the variance of the work. Depending on your goals from exercising you need variability and if you are doing the same workout every friday you are going to reduce the randomness and the variance. Also there is a possibility for you cherry picking which wods to do if you are doing the same wod once a week, or more accurately which ones you dont do. If you really want to keep track of your progress via the ladies I would do something like take all of the ladies and do a different one each friday. Try and realize which wods you are missing and make sure you are not missing the same skills over and over again. Another good thing to focus on is skill work. So make sure you are working on muscle ups, hspu, double unders, any and all of the movements you arent proficient in. And most importantly document everything.

mastroj

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Started crossfit 5/1/2009 265#‘s
“No matter whom you are you have weaknesses and Crossfit will shed light on those weaknesses, enabling you to work on them.” Me
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Posted: 02 February 2010 12:50 PM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 11 ]
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civilsid - 02 February 2010 08:39 AM

Yes, I understand that level of fitness is definitely related to amount of weight a person should be using.  The WOD, as given, is the top level or at least I would assume so but not everybody has the same weight at that top level.  I’m done beating the hell out of that dead horse- next more important topic for me is that I also understand there is a range- too fast or too slow and a range in between.  I have done several of the “ladies” over the last couple months but I am sure I have not done all of them.  Is there a target time for beginners?  On many occasions when I was first starting, I did not bother to record my time- I simply struggled to finish.  The funny thing is that it was usually not muscle exhaustion from lifting to much weight, it was simply feeling like I was going to puke so I would stop until I thought I could eek out the rest of the exercise- but I definitely had a couple DNF’s in there.  Of course, if I used a lighter weight, I may never have felt pukey at all but the stopper for me was the sick stomach feeling- which I would get regardless of rowing, running, or lifting.  Sometimes I still get that- I try to eat well- trying to stay as close to Dr. Sears Zone as possible.

But…  once I get to where I can do the exercise without getting an upset stomach, where along the range or spectrum should I be targeting?  A faster time would be a more aerobic style workout and a slower time would be more of an anaerobic one.  And I know that yes, all the exercises are different so we should maybe not aim for the same time on each of them.

What is your opinion about doing the same workout with a higher frequency?  Maybe every Friday, go back to the same set of exercises so that over a month or so, it feels better and provides more self confidence.  I think I might do that.  Of course one of the best things about CF is that it never gets boring but then I can go 3 or 4 months and not see the same workout twice but I know I am getting stronger because my max lifts slowly increase.

I would also think that the folks that can RX don’t ask these sorts of questions- they have been doing this stuff for years and they know exactly what they can and can not accomplish on a given workout.

Oh well, I guess this stuff is all very subjective and maybe we each simply need to be aware of our bodies and how we react to certain levels of exertion and just do what feels comfortable (or mildly uncomfortable, as the case may be) to us.

Any chance you could start posting your WOD results here or point us at another workout log?
You’ve popped up and started asking for help without giving us any actual data to base our advice on. Which is OK up to a point, but we kind of like to help the people who are willing to give to the forum by posting results as well as taking (people’s time) by asking questions.
It provides encouragement for others struggling through along with you and helps build the community aspect.

The best advice we can give you about what timeframes you should be aiming for is in or linked from that Beginner’s forum post I linked.
Those timeframes apply for beginners to advanced, although we’d expect to see elite athletes setting the bar higher and higher with as Rx’ed weights.

Please note when working to target timeframes that GD recommends occasionally pushing your boundaries by using a heavier weight (up to Rx’ed). He actually did this when he posted the scaled versions of a mainsite WOD a while back. Slogging through a Metcon is OK occasionally if it’s done intentionally and with the knowledge that that’s not the intent of the workout.

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Craig Massey


“The point of CF is to get better at life.  Being unable to workout tomorrow because you were pigheaded today is not in line with our goals.”
Garddawg - 22 March 2009

“CrossFit is not dangerous.
Bad coaching is dangerous, poor movement is dangerous. Ego is dangerous.
CrossFit, properly scaled to the individual is the safest and most efficient program available for strength, conditioning and movement.”
BlueBugofJustice - 18 August 2009

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Posted: 02 February 2010 07:32 PM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 12 ]
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Brand X with GD scaling, subing, and perfered times already does the work for you. Follow the WOD’s look at the scaling and hit it. Post your work outs and time and scaling. There is plenty of help here. Life is always changing nothing is set in stone.

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